
Mark Kenyon and Fitz Cahall may not appear to have much in common. Mark got his start in the outdoors at a family hunting cabin in the forest lands of Northern Michigan, and Fitz dirtbagged around the American West in the back of his Tacoma. Their passions in the outdoors might be different, but their resolve to protect Public Lands is just the same.
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Music: If Walls Could Talk by Jacob Bain & Nis Kotto • Paris by Tigers In The Sky • Delivered by Brendan O’Connell
Tracks provided with permission from the artists or from Track Club





Thanks for your podcast on the Roadless Rule and the Michigan hunting cabin. I listened to this episode while checking water diversions in Hinsdale County, CO today. I spent 22 years as a hydrologist with the USFS in California and Colorado and BLM Gunnison Field Office before taking VERA and DRP 2.0 in 2025. I am a water commissioner for the Colorado Department of Water Resources.
As a land management hydrologist, roads were known to the gift that keep on giving: sediment to water bodies and sources of hillslope failures. When assessing projects, we focused on the road network as roads have the single largest impact on non point source pollution. I spent my 3 years on the Lassen NF, decommissioning roads for watershed protection but also for wildlife habitat connectivity. With the BLM, I managed the Road Maintenance Program. The Gunnison Field Office would maybe have 30 miles of road maintained a year through contracts or the Force Account Crew of one. We also had an agreement Gunnison County to maintain another 30 miles of roads. That office has over 500 miles of roads; these roads were pioneered, not engineered. Maintaining an unsustainable road network is not possible within public lands open to roads. Adding roads to roadless area in all BLM offices will exact a burden on ecological and fiscal resources. BLM is not a road management agency and neither is the Forest Service. These agencies are public land management agencies that provide lands for sustained yield (timber management, mining, livestock grazing, developed and dispersed recreation, fisheries, municipal watersheds, and etc. ). These agencies cannot manage their current road and trail systems. Adding more roads is not feasible.
A final point about all the National Forest Reserves is that the national forests were reserved for water yield and water quality. Humboldt-Toiyabe NF is the exception as it was reserved for livestock grazing but the sustained yield act expanded it for other uses mentioned in the previous paragraph. As mentioned before, roads are the number one non point source of sediment to streams, wetland, springs, lakes, fens, and other water bodies. Adding more roads in the roadless area would create more source of sediment and be inconsistent with CWA and original reservation of NFS lands. Roads also fragment habitat for all species which would also be inconsistent with ESA. Roads impact archeological resources by providing access to our historical resources and being built in historical sites. Such roads would be inconsistent with the Antiquities and SHPO.
Thanks.
Andrew Breibart
Crested Butte, CO
Former Hydrologist with USFS Inyo NF, LTBMU, Lassen NF in CA; ARPNG in CO; and BLM Gunnison Field Office.
Current: District 62 Water Commissioner with CO Division of Water Resources